The Importance of Wise Counsel in Marriage

Sarah-Gayle: Hello, Hope Relentless Marriage. It is so good to be here with you on this podcast. We are excited to talk about some things that are going to impact your marriage. Remember, marriage impacts families, families impact communities, and communities impact the world.

Chad: That's right.

Sarah-Gayle: My Chad David actually has a birthday coming up tomorrow. I am excited to celebrate him. Chad, I do not think men really care about how old they are like women do, huh?

Chad: I know I do not. I cannot speak for all men, but I do not.

Sarah-Gayle: He is going to be 39, which is still a young buck. I am two and a half years older than him, and he reminds me of it consistently. But anyway, what are we talking about today, Chad?

Chad: Today we are going to talk about this idea of reaching out for marriage help. There are different ways and seasons, but the first thing is just to celebrate that reaching out for marriage help is a sign of strength, not weakness. We really want reaching out for relationship or marriage counseling to be something that is celebrated, promoted, and encouraged.

Sarah-Gayle: Right. Typically most people reach out when they are in crisis. A lot of the calls we get, people are about to divorce and they say this is our last chance to see if we can salvage this. It is amazing that they are reaching out, but it might be too late at that point, because hearts are hardened and they have already gone through a lot together that has not been very productive. We want to encourage people to reach out still, but there is a better way and a better season to reach out for help.

Chad: One of the other seasons is premarital, right from the get-go. If we can get counsel and wisdom and support early in our relationship, then some of those crisis moments we will avoid completely. Every relationship has challenges, so it is not like you go to premarital counseling and never have a problem. But premarital counseling can position our relationships with an incredible foundation and protect us from going into spaces that, had we known better, we might have avoided.

Sarah-Gayle: One of the things I am reminded of is John Gottman, a marriage researcher. I might be butchering the stat, so do not quote me, but the heart of it is that on average couples wait five to six years before reaching out for help, even though they already have the problem. Many of us wait way too long because of the mindset we have. At Hope Relentless we want to help you reframe what it looks like to reach out. It is not just in crisis. Premarital is huge. I love working with premarital couples. My goal is not to keep you together, it is to help you become aware of the person you hope to marry and decide if it is actually a good fit. It is a time of fun, but there are often a lot of rose-colored glasses.

Chad: That stat is kind of heartbreaking. In different seasons we have struggled with what Gottman calls perpetual problems. But there are other areas of life where we understand reaching out better. With physical health, if someone breaks a leg, that is a crisis and they go get help. Sometimes in relationship counseling we mimic that, we experience a crisis and look for help. But we also have young sons who go for annual physicals even though they have never had a major injury. Athletes see doctors and trainers, not because they are injured, but for prevention. There is so much to transfer into our relationships. Let us not deal with something for five, six, seven years. If we get help, there is a preventative element, and we will not find ourselves in hurtful cycles nearly as long.

Sarah-Gayle: That brings me to another category, getting wisdom for our marriages even when things are good. We call it married and happy. It is the continual investment in your relationship, especially when it is going well, because marriage is a lifelong journey, longer than a marathon. You continue to exercise if you want to stay healthy. When you stop, you lose muscle. Society, and our own ideals, paint a picture that it should not take work, almost like work is a negative word in marriage. But anything good and worth growing takes work.

Chad: There is a cultural element, maybe Disney, that paints the wedding day as bliss forever. If you have been in a relationship longer than a couple of weeks, you know bliss forever is unrealistic. One of those myths is that if we are meant to be together, it should be easy. It is just not. A relationship takes intentionality and proactiveness. Couples thriving over extended seasons still hit obstacles, but there is a trend of investment, whether that is listening to podcasts, reading a book, going to a counselor, a retreat, or a webinar. Those couples are so fun to work with because it is about growth, not just repair.

Sarah-Gayle: We all need accountability. We are so busy that it helps to have it. The married and happy group helps couples achieve more together than they could imagine because they stay focused and accountable. Most of us have not seen good examples of marriage, yet we jump in as two completely different people with no idea where to start. Think of driver's ed, it is mandatory because it is important and lives are at risk. I would argue marriage is even more important, because marriage impacts families, families impact communities, and communities impact the world. That leads me to a personal story. During my master's, individual therapy was mandatory, and it was going great. I thought it would be fun to bring Chad in for couples counseling. There was a moment where the counselor said, "Sarah-Gayle, when Chad hurts your feelings, you want him to say sorry, and not only that, you want him to promise he will never do it again and show his remorse." And I thought, my counselor knows what he is talking about. Then he betrayed me and said, no, that is not healthy. You are wanting Chad to say sorry for everyone in your life who has hurt you, to pay the price for all of that pain. And I was like, okay.

Chad: I remember showing up to that couples counseling in Pasadena, probably two or three years into marriage. I showed up because the master's program gave extra hours for couples counseling, so I was being strategic, pay for one hour, get credit for three. Then the counselor started setting it up and I thought, I am never coming back, this is no good. Then he flipped the script and I thought, I like this guy. The bigger picture is he was creating a safe space to dialogue, learn, and become aware of potential hurdles. We did not show up with boxing gloves in a difficult season. One thing I like about counseling, even in a good season, is it creates a safe space to talk about challenging topics.

Chad: A different thing I remember was premarital. At 17, almost 18 years of marriage now, we are reaping the fruit of a couple of things we did right. We went to premarital counseling at our church. The first pastor basically said, you guys are awesome, you love each other, this is going to be great, and we walked out concerned. We felt we needed more than a pat on the back. A different pastor gave us practical tools, including the unique challenges an interracial couple might face. That helped prepare us. Those moments of getting counsel and wisdom outside of a crisis served us really well.

Sarah-Gayle: To this day we have marriage mentors we meet with regularly who sow into our marriage, and we are forever grateful. We have pursued that, grief recovery for me, Celebrate Recovery for Chad, different things, not from a place of being so broken that someone has to fix me, but from a place of strength. I have big dreams. I want to experience God's best for marriage, so I will do what it takes.

Chad: As we wrap up, a specific action step is to find different ways to proactively invest in your relationship, a counselor, a marriage book, or an older couple with a thriving marriage who can speak into your life. There is so much fruit on the other side of taking intentional steps. Your marriage is worth it. If Hope Relentless and our team can be part of that, we would consider it an honor. And find someone who is a good fit. If you go to a counselor and it is not a great fit, do not just stop, try again. I have walked into restaurants where the food was bad. It does not mean I never go to another restaurant.

Sarah-Gayle: The last thing I will say is, we do not know what we do not know. Through that couples counseling I learned why I had such a hard time saying sorry, that I felt if I had to apologize, I had messed up as a person and it impacted my value. I realized that was the pattern I was perpetuating in the next generation. That is the power of a different lens. So reach out for help. You are worth it, and it is going to be worth it. The fact that you are listening to this, well done. Remember, there is always, always hope.